Jay Holloway
Congresswoman Eva Clayton has always been a powerful leader and advocate for those without a voice. She will introduce bills to help North Carolinians across all economic lines. Stay tuned to learn more about Eva Clayton on Black Issues Forum. [MUSIC]

Jay Holloway
Congresswoman Eva Clayton is an organizational genius. She began by running a household with four children and her attorney husband. Now she helps run another kind of house, the House of Representatives in Washington, D.C. Welcome to the show, Congresswoman Clayton, so nice to have you here.

Eva Clayton
Thank you for having me.

Jay Holloway
We certainly appreciate you taking the time out of your busy schedule. We've been trying to get you here, we are delighted to have you here in the studio.

Eva Clayton
My pleasure, I'm glad it worked out.

Jay Holloway
You represent North Carolinians in the eastern part of the state, tell us again, or tell us to start with, the area of North Carolina that you represent.

Eva Clayton
Well, the first congressional district is the largest, not the first, I think people should get that in mind. It goes northern from the Virginia line. It goes from Vance County to Pasquotank County, along the Virginia line. So, basically that is north east. Also I have a southern tier beginning in Cumberland County going towards New Hanover. So I have Cumberland County, Bladen County, Duplin County, Pender County and then New Hanover, in that area. Also have a central part. Greenville. I have New Bern, I have Kinston. I have 28 counties partially, or in their entirety. I actually have 8 whole counties and have 20 counties that are partial counties.

Jay Holloway
So in terms of numbers of districts, you almost have a quarter of the state, in terms of numbers.

Eva Clayton
Yes.

Jay Holloway
Let's talk about Eva Clayton the person, first, before we get into some of the issues and what you do. What led you, in terms of career path, to Congress. What were you doing before then?

Eva Clayton
Well, I really hadn't had an opportunity to be engaged in a lot of things. I started out, like many people, I started out as a teacher in high school science. Became a principal at one time in my life. I have been a non-profit executive. I was a university administrator, here at the University of North Carolina. I served in State Government for 3 years as assistant secretary for Community Development and Natural Resources. I entered business for a period of ten and a half yea s. I ran my own management consultant firm, primarily in planning and technical assistance, doing business development plans for business persons, or community development studies or credit needs analysis for banks and credit institutions. So, I was a business person before I ran for Congress, but also I was an elected official at the local level. I was a County Commissioner in Warren County which is my home county. So, those are my background activities that led me. But I think what led me to this ef fort was not that I had been those. I think what led me to this effort was that I saw this as an opportunity to serve. For the same reason I did the other things. I was a teacher because I saw this opportunity to share or to learn or to share what I had learned with others and challenge their intellect.

Jay Holloway
Has public service always been part of your career path?

Eva Clayton
I think so, but I can't honestly ever say that I grew up wanting to be a member of Congress. That was not in my vision then. Actually in my vision, as I grew up, I really wanted to be a doctor missionary. I wanted to go to Africa. I wanted to study medicine, I wanted to go to theology. And one of the idols for me happened to be Abris Weinstein, a most unlikely idol for a black young woman, who is Jewish and a physician, a surgeon, a pianist, a philosopher and a religious pers on. My other idol was Mary McLeod Bethune who is black and a female and who was an educator. So I think I had both a kind of theological process going within me. I had a more practical, like one to be a teacher, but thought being a doctor missionary in Africa, that was my goal, my vision, was to go to Africa to serve. I never got there. I went to college as a pre-med student, I met my husband and the rest is history.

Jay Holloway
Have you been to Africa yet?

Eva Clayton
Yes, I have. I have had the opportunity about 3 1/2 years ago when Mandela became the president of South Africa, I was part of the representation that represented this country at his inauguration and I hope to go back several times.

Jay Holloway
Great. I know you told me before we came on the air you just met with a delegation recently from Africa.

Eva Clayton
Yes, I did. That was a great pleasure for North Carolina. They were visiting our state, as they were visiting other states in the South to get a feel for the United States beyond the Beltway. So, I thought it was a novel idea that most Americans do live outside the Beltway and that is the way you get to see us.

Jay Holloway
We're going to talk about a lot of those issues coming up very shortly, and especially as it relates to when you go beyond the Beltline in Raleigh Durham here and you get to the rural areas, which our state is largely rural, and you represent that and we are going to talk about those issues, but before we move into the issues, one other personal question. All that you talked about that you did before leading you to Congress is a lot for any person, any man to do. But a woman wh o also, historically kind of helps with the house, and we said that at the beginning of the situation, a lot of women must really admire you and what do you say, what words of encouragement would you give to young women, especially African-American women.

Eva Clayton
Well, I tell them, really, when they recognize that their mothers, their grandmothers, their aunts and the relatives they have known have done a tremendous amount of things. When I recognize even in my background no one ever achieved to an office seeker. But my mother was a unique person. And when we recognize that my achievement is really building off a foundation of people. I stand on the shoulders of a lot of people and I hope that someone will stand on my shoulders. You know, a woman could be president. Women should begin to think of themselves as not having barriers to overcome outside of themselves. The first barrier to overcome is within ourselves. Now, in 1992 I ran. Now, I had run for Congress once before and didn't win, but I really wasn't thinking about running as much in 1992 as you may think. I was encouraged to run, to be honest with you. A group of people came to me and said, this is a good time, having redistricted. Plus, you bring the right kind of attributes and attitude and season that you should do that. But the one thing that was happening in 1992 that boosted my career and my confidence, that women were springing up all over. Women just had that I-Can-Do attitude. That is what we must have. We must have that I-Can-Do. And you can get that I-Can-Do if you realize your mother did, you are doing right now. You are managing a household. At the beginning of the program you said I managed my household and now I manage...all women manage their households. That is how we get up and dress our kids, we have to realize what time they come home from school, we have to think about what we are going to feed them, what clothes they are going to wear, plus what we're going to do and what jobs we have.

Jay Holloway
Now, speaking of that I happen to know that you don't have kids any longer.

Eva Clayton
No, I have grandkids. I have four adult kids but I have four wonderful grandchildren, so I have three grandsons and one granddaughter.

Jay Holloway
Isn't that wonderful.

Eva Clayton
Oh, it is. It is.

Jay Holloway
Well, let's talk about some of the issues now, because I know you are very astute on a lot of issues, not only in terms of North Carolina but specifically your constituency, which is largely rural. What are some of the major issues that you are concerned about?

Eva Clayton
Well, I'm concerned about quality of life issues as a general, how people live, how they are able to manage their families, how they are able to cope and are they doing well, and what stresses. Those are basic things I'm concerned with. But I live in eastern North Carolina where agriculture is a big factor in the lives of the economic vitality of those communities. I serve on an agriculture committee. And for that reason I am engaged in those issues that relate to the producti on of certain crops that are important. Tobacco is an issue, that is obvious. But it is also a big issue for the survival of many eastern North Carolinians, because they are engaged in farming and they see that as a cash crop.

Jay Holloway
Now, with all this talk about the legalities of these tobacco companies on tobacco being a drug and that kind of thing. What do you have to say to those that are involved not only in the production of that crop, but the consumers in our state.

Eva Clayton
Well, it is a big issue. It is a big issue. I tell people I don't advocate smoking. In fact, I know smoking is not good for your health. I advise my kids not to smoke, they don't. But, it is an adult decision in the final analysis. I'm very appreciative that my kids don't smoke and now my husband, after ten years, hasn't smoked at all. I am delighted they made those decisions. Those are healthy decisions. But in the long run each of us as an adult has to make that decisio n. And certainly anything that is encouraging kids to begin to take that habit should be discouraged. So I certainly support all efforts that say that anyone who is doing that should be held accountable for that, and the corporation themselves should not do anything that would entice them into making that habit before they are mature enough to make that decision.

Jay Holloway
But on the other hand, many of your constituents are farmers that are farming tobacco, right?

Eva Clayton
Absolutely. And they will be effected. And I'm concerned about that. You can't...there is always an up and down side of this issue. If, indeed, cigarettes were banned altogether, many of the farmers who now grow that would be devastated in many ways. They would have to find alternative methods of providing for themselves or a substitute crop in that area. And many are beginning to do that. Many farmers are beginning to find, what can I do, what can I grow other than. So my district, in addition to tobacco, I have peanuts, I have cotton, I have soy beans. I have a variety of crops. North Carolina is number in flue cured tobacco. And, by the way, my Congressional District happened to produce more flue-cured tobacco than any other Congressional district of the United States, so it is a big factor. We grow a lot. We export a lot. We also export a lot of sweet potatoes. But we also export a lot of peanuts, pork, poultry, so there are a variety of agricultural products in w hich we export, so those are the kinds of agricultural business products that I'm concerned about. But I'm also concerned about rural issues about housing, about business development, about economic opportunity regionally, about the environment. Most importantly, I'm concerned about the quality of education. Eastern North Carolina has, in many of the counties, have a low wealth base. Their tax base is not sufficient all the time to supplement the educational offerings to make it competitive with the rest of the state. So great effort has to be made in order for that to happen. And education initiatives that are available through the Federal Government or through the State need to be concentrated so that eastern North Carolina can benefit from that.

Jay Holloway
Now, in terms of the whole budget issue, budget affects a lot of these issues and what are your major concerns in terms of the budget effecting your rural constituents as well as all North Carolinians.

Eva Clayton
Well, the budget is a big issue. First, balancing the budget is a big issue. And when we say balancing, it sounds very simple, that we can balance the budget. This is a five year budget that we will approve this Congressional term. That five year budget will insure that there is balanced budget by the year 2002. It is a five year process. It simply means that you are having to make some hard choices. And in those choices, some things will remain as they are, some things wil l be cut, other things will be added. The budget that we are considering this term has actually some new provisions for education, which I'm pleased to say, I'm encouraged by that. For the first time we will increase Pell Grant for college kids, for kids to go to college, and particularly those that are from disadvantaged families. Up to $3,000. A 30% increase. And that is a big incentive. President Clinton also has a Hope Scholarship for anyone who wants to finish high school, he insures that there will at least be a 2 year post-high school education through the Hope Scholarship. So, if you combine the Hope Scholarship and the Pell Grant, that means there is an opportunity, not only for disadvantaged, but for all who want to go in that area.

Jay Holloway
: Now, I know what you're talking about in terms of these Pell Grants and opportunities, but a lot of our audience or maybe even our younger folks may not know how accessible that is, even now or what this means, whether it has passed or not. But do you want to talk about the real affordability for your constituents, but all North Carolinians, to go to college.

Eva Clayton
The Pell Grant is probably the best tool there is, and any college finance officer will know about it. But I will tell anyone listening that you ask you financial officer, even the high school counselor should know about it. The Pell Grant means that one can get, it is a grant, Pell Grant, Pell is the name of the person it was named after who was a Senator by the name of Pell. He thought of it so they named it after him. But you can get up to $3,000 a year for attending colleg e. That is something you do not have to pay back. Now, obviously you are eligible for that based on need. If your family income shows that you are at the level where you should be receiving that, you would have the opportunity to do that. The Hope Scholarship is additional. It is a $1,500 scholarship per year that can be available at any two year school or any first and second of a four year school. So you would have that combination of those. In some instances you may be eligible for the Hope Scholarship and not eligible for the Pell Grant because, perhaps your income is not low enough to get the Pell Grant. But the Pell Grant is easy to assess. You simply ask your financial officer at the individual college that you're interested in, if you're making application. You should indicate on your application that you will need financial assistance and you would like to see what grant and scholarship programs your college would have. There are a variety of other scholarships too that individual colleges may have.

Jay Holloway
So, college is affordable and these federal...

Eva Clayton
Some are. And I want to tell you, some of the colleges are not affordable, because some go up to $30,000, $40,000 dollars. So, obviously, if you have $4,500 out of $40,000 the affordability is questionable. But in North Carolina we are blessed. We have community colleges and we have first rate state schools and we have a variety of private schools that are not too high. But in some instances there are very expensive schools, so one has to shop around to try to find an afforda ble school.

Jay Holloway
While we are talking about education, let's work back from the college on back, now. You talked about the community colleges, the public institutions, the private. I happen to know you are a product of one of our private institutions in this state. What about the historical black colleges, wouldn't you have to say that some feel that they are a form of segregation, that they don't have a place in society. I have heard that before. Would you like to address the need and the purpose of historically black colleges and universities.

Eva Clayton
Well, historical black colleges have always played a critical role. They are currently playing a critical role. And as far as I can see in the future, they will play a critical role. Now, their role in the past was there obviously because there weren't options before. The role that they are playing now is in the arena knowing that there are other options that one may have to go to school, you can choose not only to go to historical black private school, historical public supported school, but you have a variety of other options to go, that are not historically black schools. One has to have a competitive institution to stay viable in the environment when there is such competition in that area. And I think they will continue to play a role. There are many professionals now who would not have had the opportunity if they had not had the opportunity to attend historical black schools. The value of the smaller school is that that is a place to grow and to be nurtured. Now, obviously the cultural confidence it gives a minority, that you can grow and develop socially, but also you grow politically. You grow as being a reinforcement of your well-being and who you are, your sense of purpose as a member of a certain minority culture. There is nothing wrong in having that reinforcement. That is not to say that if whites came to those schools they wouldn't be accepted. It is simply to say that it is an affirmation of your cultural heritage, which some people find very reassuring.

Jay Holloway
One of the statistics I recently heard about our state is that in terms of 19 year olds going to college, believe it or not we are ranked 43rd. I don't know if that is related to the military bases being here, but you would think that we would have more in school. And then when you couple that with the alarming statistics of the disparity between minorities and non-minorities in terms of performing on these placement tests during the K through 12 areas, it seems that we've got some real challenges in our K through 12 public school system in North Carolina. Do you have any comments about that ?

Eva Clayton
I had not heard those statistics, but I heard today as a whole, not just North Carolina, that minorities are decreasing in the number of students in attendance to four year college, both Hispanic as well as African-Americans. And that was alarming because four years ago they did a review of a five year span and showed where there had been an increase of 20%. And I think blacks had increased over 1994 to 1995 by 2%, Hispanic had by only 4%. And both of those instances that was down from the previous year of assessment. And that is alarming. I had not heard the statistics about North Carolina attendance. However, I am aware of North Carolina's generally poor performance nationally, on certain reading averages and mathematical tests they use to assess during the year. And although there has been some slight increase, there really hasn't been an increase as a whole. I think people are beginning to come to grips with that. I think the Governor has made an honest, energetic effort to begin to come to grips with the fact that if you don't have good teachers, you are not willing to pay them, you are not recruiting the best quality teachers, you can't expect to have the best product. And apparently, I think the General Assembly is going to be poised to increase the salary, bring up the academic standards and requirements of teaching. But also to bring a more rigorous academic curriculum so students can be competitive in the 21st century. We can't afford to let our kids be less than vigorous in the pursuit of education. I have a saying that sometimes we want to dumb down to the lowest common denominator, it is called the minimalist theory, give them the least to get them by. North Carolina cannot thrive, lest survive, if we don't do well in education because our investment, education investment is an investment in our young people and if we invest in our young people that is the only way we can be competitive with the other states, or be competitive as a community.

Jay Holloway
We just have a few minutes left and I know that you are concerned about other issues that effect students going on to get their educations, like teen pregnancy. And then, when they get out, we are looking at possibly repealing affirmative action. You want to say anything about those two issues, I know they are loaded issues?

Eva Clayton
Sure. Well, loaded or not they are important issues. I have, as a priority, to work in the area, try to get young people to delay becoming parents prematurely. Teen-age pregnancy is a phenomenal drain on our society financially. We spend almost $2 1/2 billion dollars every year just on the birth of teen-age mother's children. And the loss of productivity exceeds more than $29 billion annually when you consider not only the health and care of the children, or the birth of the hildren, but the loss of the productivity of that young person's if they had stayed in school and was contributing to society. But more than a financial loss, is a loss of these young people developing themselves, the potential they could be if they had just delayed that decision until they had kind of grown up themselves, until they had gotten through high school and maybe looked at some career options. And then had children when they were more mature and had developed so they could take care of them ps ychologically, as well as take care of them monetarily.

Jay Holloway
Congresswoman, when, let's say they put that off, and now affirmative action is going out. And part of that statistic, with the low attendance in college, had to do, for example in California, they had...

Eva Clayton
Texas too.

Jay Holloway
Texas, yeah. I think in California too in terms of repealing that. What do you have to say about the whole issue of affirmative action and what we have to deal with in terms of race relations.

Eva Clayton
Well, you know, it is sad and it is alarming. I think you are right, those statistics we were reviewing earlier had, maybe, a direct result of the implementation of what California and Texas were doing. I think we are going to find when we deny any part of our society and opportunity to fully participate this society will pay a cost for that. We're paying a cost now for the neglect of children, the neglect of the underclass. We have a big underclass going now. We have, our ja ils are just bulging. We pay for that neglect. And if you deny African-Americans, Hispanics, you deny anyone a full citizenship, the whole will suffer in those regards.

Jay Holloway
Well, time has run completely out. Any final concluding comments you would like to make to the audience.

Eva Clayton
I certainly want to thank you. I forgot to talk about the African-American farmers who are losing out as well. But perhaps I'll come back another show and we'll have the opportunity to talk about that.

Jay Holloway
Look forward to that. Thank you so much for taking time out of your busy schedule.

Eva Clayton
Okay.

Jay Holloway
Well, we certainly want to thank you and we know that you have heard about legislation Congresswoman Eva Clayton has and is sponsoring and you know your needs, and if what you have learned tonight can help you or help your citizens and colleagues in the state, please write or call Congresswoman Clayton in Washington, D.C. You will find her address on our web site and of course you can contact us at (919) 549-7167. Or write to us in the Research Triangle Park at the address on y our screen or send us e-mail at bif@unctv.org. Or catch us on the World Wide Web at www.unctv.org/bif. We want to thank you again for watching Black Issues Forum and you have a blessed evening and a good night.

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